Need help with office layout

[CaptOblivious]

Finally, we're finished moving, and even almost done unpacking (don't have a lot of stuff). My wife and I are setting up an office for me in our bedroom. And, the best part is: I've finally got space for a layout! Woot! So now it's my turn to ask for advice, because I'm stuck. Here're the constraints I face:

• I've got room for a small L-shaped point-to-point shelf layout in the corner of the room (see attached photos). The red box shows an 18in aisle so I can get to my desk. It might be necessary to reduce this aisle a bit to get 317mm radius track in, and I'm OK with that.
• I don't want to change focus too drastically. My roster is largely focused on trains that run through or near Ueno Station; I also have some Kintetsu B-Train Shorties (and maybe some other Kansai area ones in the future). So, maybe something generically urban.
• Full length trains are obviously out, but I'd like to be able to enjoy some kind of operations; two stations at either end? One in the middle with fiddle yards? Anyway, this layout isn't just for my enjoyment, but should serve as a suitable testbed for Railstars's products, which are geared towards operations and automation.
• FWIW, I have the Tomix Elevated Station (an older version of this one: http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10070381 ), and if there is a nice way to incorporate it into the layout that would be nice. Of course, the station as a whole is quite large…too large, really.
• I already have a small stock of Tomix track, so I lean towards using it, but I'm open to using other kinds of track as well (especially if it's cheaper!)
• Bonus points for designs that I can easily break down and transport to train shows in my car (which has generous trunk space, a Honda Fit).(Need not be modular, just not a lot of work to dismantle. So, no large mountain ranges perhaps.)

Looking forward to seeing what all you come up with.

[bill937ca]

My tables are 30 inches wide, just a bit bigger than your space.  In that space I can do up to radius of Tomix track C354, C317, C280, C243. I generally stick to four car trains although I do have one seven car train on my layout.  Basically its three running paths with an siding at one end.

[CaptOblivious]

Oops, in the diagram, I've got greater-than signs where there should be less-than signs! Those lengths represent absolute maxima (on pain of running into the chair or the bed)!

Bill, 30 inches is going to be pushing it a bit, but it might happen.

I'm leaning more towards making this a B-Train shorty layout, opening up the possibility of much tighter radii…although it would be nice if I could run full-length rolling stock too, on at least one track…

[Webskipper]

Do you really want our help in planning or to help your will power not to run track throughout the office like a habit rail?

I can fit one meter objects in my '00 Insight.

How about an Ntrak table about 36" long. 2 of them plus a corner module. As long as the length of the scene is a multiple of 2 feet your good for shows.

[CaptOblivious]

Do you really want our help in planning or to help your will power not to run track throughout the office like a habit rail?

Oh, I've got the willpower. It's called my wife ;)

How about an Ntrak table about 36" long. 2 of them plus a corner module. As long as the length of the scene is a multiple of 2 feet your good for shows.

Possibly; When I say train shows, I guess I should be more specific: Railstars, my business, will need a demo layout to set up at its booth to convince convention-goers to buy our products. So, no need to conform to any particular standard (although no harm in going with Ntrak). But there does need to be enough trackage complexity to justify block detection, interesting degrees of signaling, turnout control, all that good stuff.

[Krackel Hopper]

I think a couple Ntrak modules would be a great idea for a train show.

Ntrak clubs are certainly one of the bigger markets in the US.

It's a simple matter of displaying your goods in a medium the public understands.  If they can see your DCC products in use over a couple different Ntrak modules, it will be easier for them to grasp the design and function and how it relates to what they are doing with their own Ntrak modules.

Then it's just a matter of figuring out exactly what features you want to display.. turntable? signals? turnouts?

[DanMacK]

Just knocked this up, and were I in your situation, it's a layout I'd build.  It uses alot of Tomix track with a section of Peco flex in the station area.  The two outside tracks could be used with the elevated station and possibly a lower level single track line winding under the viaduct at left and terminationg on a lower level?

The red lines indicate a section break.

Not sure if it's what you're looking for, but it's just a thought.

[CaptOblivious]

Dan, an interesting plan, and one that gives me some ideas. Can you tell me what you find compelling about it?

Just knocked this up, and were I in your situation, it's a layout I'd build.  It uses alot of Tomix track with a section of Peco flex in the station area.  The two outside tracks could be used with the elevated station and possibly a lower level single track line winding under the viaduct at left and terminationg on a lower level?

The red lines indicate a section break.

Not sure if it's what you're looking for, but it's just a thought.

[DanMacK]

Well, you said you wanted space for full length trains.  For me, it's moreso about the branchlines, but I think a terminal plan offers the best if I were to branch out into mainline or commuter.  Will it handle a 16 car Shinkansen?  No, but with 4 good length tracks you should be able to get some pretty good operation happening there, plus the double crossover between the middle tracks gives you an option for switching ends of loco-hauled trains.If you wanted, as I said, you could do a single track branch, or, if trams are more your style, do a double track Unitram loop on that side with a hidden back half under the station.

It also has good signalling possibilities, a 4 track station to a double track to a single track.  I was assuming the layout would be high enough to clear the desk and a 4-track, 6" wide fiddle yard could be run along to the opposite wall.

[cteno4]

Capt

An idea for the show modules/demo could be something very schematic, maybe even with a plex base might be cool and attractive, showing off neat wiring and boards for you to use as a demonstration/teaching tool. I'm thinking a more refined layout may be more distracting from your wares. If you have a lot of cool features with your system I think showing them in the schematic would help in presentation. Being able to point to the various bits while its running and you are talking could be cool.

Your product is not about scenery or module/layout type/design specially so keep things schematic. Perhaps have a binder of diagrams of how your unit could be applied to the classic ntrak and layout situations. Sorry thinking what might be fun at home might not be the best selling presentation for your product. Just a thought.

Cheers

Jeff

[Webskipper]

Oh, so demonstration tables.

This is a program track.

This is how to consist.

This is how to digitally control a switch or switches.

Lights.

This how transponding looks on your computer.

This is my lovely assistant to collect your cash here at the show. :)

[The_Ghan]

Very bad feng shui in that room ... for a start it has a bed in it!  Being an architect, I'd like to know where the window is and where the robes are. 

Subject to those items I'd be doing a dog-bone along one wall rather than a corner unit, but I like to have straight sections of track that are longer than the trains.  Here's how I'd do it:

1. Leave the bed where it is;
2. Put the bookshelf by the door where the small desk is;
3. Put the small desk by the bed where part of your current layout space is;
4. Turn the large desk 90^o so that it has it's back to the door;
5. Run a long dog-bone layout up the western wall.

One of my favourite sites for layouts is the Atlas site.  If it were me, I'd start with either this True-Track or this Code 55 layout and adapt.

If you're keen to stick with the corner layout I'd do something like this.

With some modification I can see that all three offer the opportunity to model countryside, town, and yard - a combination that I like.  I'm also a fan of loops and passing tracks.  The dog bones can be a single loop with a station in the middle ... and you have your passing tracks. 

I prefer the Code 55 layout as a starting point.  Here's how I'd modify it:

1. Duplicate the main loop;
2. Add a branch line that runs something like the Hakone Tozan or Fuji train;
3. The right end of the bone would be hilly, with a couple of tunnels and a small station at the top for two cars or so.  If you're going for the Hakone train, it will handle Tomix C243 curves with ease and will even go around the C177 curves.  This looks good modelled on a hilly terrain;
4.  The left end of the bone would be industrial, with a loop winding down to a storage yard of 4-6 sidings on the level below.  There may also be some sidings above ground with sheds, etc.;
5.  The middle would be the 5-6 platform station, with a printed town scene behind a row or two of buildings.  Because of the double loop you would have trains coming and going from this hub station all the time.  You could even squeeze in the express track that misses the platforms altogether;
6.  The C391 loop can easily be accommodated on a 3' square.  If that won't fit I'd do my double loop using C354 and C317, which means Shinkansens would still look great.

I've just wasted half an hour of work time doing this post ... I'll try and knock up something tonight at home if you're interested.

Cheers

The_Ghan

[keitaro]

Very bad feng shui in that room ... for a start it has a bed in it!  Being an architect, I'd like to know where the window is and where the robes are. 

Subject to those items I'd be doing a dog-bone along one wall rather than a corner unit, but I like to have straight sections of track that are longer than the trains.  Here's how I'd do it:

1. Leave the bed where it is;
2. Put the bookshelf by the door where the small desk is;
3. Put the small desk by the bed where part of your current layout space is;
4. Turn the large desk 90^o so that it has it's back to the door;
5. Run a long dog-bone layout up the western wall.

One of my favourite sites for layouts is the Atlas site.  If it were me, I'd start with either this True-Track or this Code 55 layout and adapt.

If you're keen to stick with the corner layout I'd do something like this.

With some modification I can see that all three offer the opportunity to model countryside, town, and yard - a combination that I like.  I'm also a fan of loops and passing tracks.  The dog bones can be a single loop with a station in the middle ... and you have your passing tracks. 

I prefer the Code 55 layout as a starting point.  Here's how I'd modify it:

1. Duplicate the main loop;
2. Add a branch line that runs something like the Hakone Tozan or Fuji train;
3. The right end of the bone would be hilly, with a couple of tunnels and a small station at the top for two cars or so.  If you're going for the Hakone train, it will handle Tomix C243 curves with ease and will even go around the C177 curves.  This looks good modelled on a hilly terrain;
4.  The left end of the bone would be industrial, with a loop winding down to a storage yard of 4-6 sidings on the level below.  There may also be some sidings above ground with sheds, etc.;
5.  The middle would be the 5-6 platform station, with a printed town scene behind a row or two of buildings.  Because of the double loop you would have trains coming and going from this hub station all the time.  You could even squeeze in the express track that misses the platforms altogether;
6.  The C391 loop can easily be accommodated on a 3' square.  If that won't fit I'd do my double loop using C354 and C317, which means Shinkansens would still look great.

I've just wasted half an hour of work time doing this post ... I'll try and knock up something tonight at home if you're interested.

Cheers

The_Ghan

Nice

[KenS]

I think you're right to stick to short trains of no more than 4 or so cars. I think 6 would be too long, but 5 might work.  While that's a bit short for a Shinkansen or commuter EMU, it could work for a short EMU, loco-hauled "Blue" trains and freights.

Given a "Tokyo north of Ueno" locale, consider the area around Nippori, Nishi-Nippori, Tabata, and Akabane along the Tohoku Main Line (with parallel Yamanote, Keihin-Tohoku, and the Tabata Freight Branch (cutoff from Tabata depot to the Joban line) as well as an overhead Shinkansen viaduct.  This would let you do something with multiple levels and multiple tracks at the left end (and maybe a small engine depot at the back or in the corner; Tabata even has a turntable you could control) and a second station at the right end.  You could even fit in a small tram line (the Toden Arakawa line wraps around and under Arakawa station, which would work at the left end).

Plenty of room for multiple tracks, switches, signals and even some ground-level crossings you could monitor/control via DCC.

It would be track-heavy done that way, but that's reasonable for a demo layout, and fairly common for small shelf layouts.

[The_Ghan]

Here's my first draft of what I was talking about earlier.  The main platforms will take 8 cars.  The Hakone line will take 3-4.  Obviously needs refining.

Cheers

The_Ghan

[disturbman]

Captain, do you think it's wise for you to have a Japanese themed layout when the majority of your market is oriented toward north american freight? And I agree with Jeff, I think your work layout should be minimal to emphasize what Railstar is marketing.

[bill937ca]

Captain, do you think it's wise for you to have a Japanese themed layout when the majority of your market is oriented toward north american freight? And I agree with Jeff, I think your work layout should be minimal to emphasize what Railstar is marketing.

I have wondered about this too.

[CaptOblivious]

Just a heads-up, I've been reading your replies, but I haven't yet had time to sit down and say anything…response forthcoming, I promise!

[KenS]

Here's a quick sketch of my idea I worked up, using Tomix track in Rail Modeller.

I varied the original concept a bit for track/space reasons (I couldn't fit in a freight line or engine yard, so I made the shop facility a small tram shop (with a turntable). The Shinkansen line is essentially just scenery (an excuse for a viaduct and an overhead station above the lower tram and commuter stations, with insufficient room to run a train unless you wanted a four-car out-and-back bullet train with no crossover).  The tram line and commuter line would both be operational, although the commuter line is limited to 3-car EMUs.

As I noted previously, it's a bit track-heavy.  The operational possibilities are also pretty limited, which is definitely a minus.

[disturbman]

Don, I just used some (pink) translucent plexyglass (or Acrylglass) to repair one of my doors (one panel was broken and needed to be replaced) and I must say, I think it's a beautiful material. I also think it could be a perfect base for a demonstration layout. I don't know if it's easy to use or not but really, with maybe with some soft lighting under it, it could make a great support to highlight the action on the top and not have the customer focus too much on the scenery... Or maybe I'm still under the charm of a Z scale propaganda I had laid eyes on in the 90's. It was only mirrors and it was incredible even if a just plain.