New and exciting UniTram switch news for 2012

[IST]

I was in Stuttgart to see again the Modellbau Süd event (900 km drive from home) and look what I found at Kato:

[Hobby Dreamer]

I must be missing something... IS the brown piece an upside-down switch/turnout??

Hopefully you are right... a switch and some individual track without the road, or at least just 2 lanes would be nice!!!

Rick

[bill937ca]

You would expect that to show up first in Japan but there is no sign of it.  You sure its not an aftermarket product?

[IST]

Of course it was not a real switch just a moulding which represented that they are working on it. It was in an official Kato pavilion, so we asked the staff about it. There was a guy who looked like Japanese and he answered that Kato is working on a switch which can be released in 4-5 month, this was represented by the moulding. He started to say a lot of things about the Unitram system, but I told him that I have already have one set. :-)
I asked him about trams, that it would be great if there will be another type. He said that a Combino type tram is on the list as it is operating different countries, so it would be sell well. It sounds wonderful, I hope they will make it.
In the pavilion there were showed a lot of Kato Shinkansens, I would post some (bad) photo as well, but we have just arrived to home.

[Webskipper]

I was in Stuttgart to see again the Modellbau Süd event (900 km drive from home) and look what I found at Kato:

Oh those cruel bastards.  Knew they will release switches someday. Now I have to rethink my infant layout to allow replacement of the curves with switches for future layouts.  I can send trams anywhere now. A tram passing is a reality.

What did the Rep say about left hand Drive?

[IST]

What did the Rep say about left hand Drive?

Nothing. :-( But if they are thinking about releasing European trams...

Small video from me:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/Pj6N-6WASeo" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/Pj6N-6WASeo</a>

[Hobby Dreamer]

Thanks IST !

I guess I did not understand your first thread because I  did not realize there was a mold in the photo..

Did the Kato staff reveal anything else such as other track options (single track, 2-lane, tighter radii, individual track pieces etc)??

There is an obvious way to use this turnout but I wonder if there is enough track geometry to try something quite different?  I want a tram yard and having turnouts splice out to make one can work but the embedded road system may not allow for it seamlessly. Maybe use the Kato turnout  to get to the tram yard but then somehow switch to Tomix Tram track because their track is suited to a yard.

In any event, this is great news because it breaks the loops we now have... (and Kato was there first!)...

BTW, the link, below, is good for Kato and Tomix tram track ideas... You can see the obvious use for the turnout but I hope there will be more track of various lengths, for example, to accommodate different layouts..

http://jw_cad.fukurail.gozaru.jp/pattern/KATO/UNITRAM.html

Time to plan a layout!!!

Thanks again
Rick

[westfalen]

Great news!

I also see one of the Y points in the background. Kato's track department must be working overtime.

[bill937ca]

It looks like this is the segment Kato will produce



You could have two corners of these and a 90 degree crossover at an intersection which should be sufficient.

[Webskipper]

62mm Tram Tracks next to the Crossing! Many choices now.

[brill27mcb]

It looks like this is the segment Kato will produce



You could have two corners of these and a 90 degree crossover at an intersection which should be sufficient.

No Bill, your image does not have the track centers widening from 25mm to 33mm at the 45-degree angle, like the Unitram curves have. Also, it looks like the sample at the show had the curve and straight routes ending symmetrically at the same point. The needed 90-degree double crossover is already in production -- it's the intersection shown in the right side of IST's photo.

A street turnout in the offing is great news!

Rich K.

[to2leo]

IMHO in the ideal world, I think Kato should start selling single tram track or double tram tracks without the plates.  That way, it is much cheaper than it is now and more importantly be able for people to use it with Tomix's road track.  The turnout is difinitely good news but with existing V-series Unitram selling close to $100 US, I wonder if turnout would be selling for more than $100 USD.  A price point that is close to or beyond a level that many are willing to pay.

[Webskipper]

It will be interesting to see how they package this.

The switches can be swapped with regular curves.

The switch package will most likely include one switch, one curve, and a 62mm straight piece like the current round about.

 Total of two full curved plates with one switch each.

[cteno4]

only issue about mixing and matching kato unitram with the tomix road track is the different spacing/geometries will require a lot of filling in to do and then remarking etc.

the unitram has started to work out to not be a cheap item, but a lot of that is the yen's doing this as well. trains that use to be $120 are now $200.

kato has liked the idea of doing the full road plate thing since before unitram came along, think they will hold onto this hard...

jeff

[bill937ca]

IMHO in the ideal world, I think Kato should start selling single tram track or double tram tracks without the plates.  That way, it is much cheaper than it is now and more importantly be able for people to use it with Tomix's road track.  The turnout is definitely good news but with existing V-series Unitram selling close to $100 US, I wonder if turnout would be selling for more than $100 USD.  A price point that is close to or beyond a level that many are willing to pay.

I don`t think any tram track is really cheap. Tram lines are about junctions and switches.  Switches are always the most expensive piece of track. 

The cost and weight of Unitram packages remains a major obstacle for me, plus Unitram does not represent what appeals to me in trams.

This would have been different if Kato had started with double or single tram track with the adjoining pavement and sidewalks added as snap-on pieces.  At its most basic you could have a double track line with sidewalks on each side like many European streets.

[Hobby Dreamer]

I don`t think any tram track is really cheap. Tram lines are about junctions and switches.  Switches are always the most expensive piece of track.

I feel the price of both the Kato and Tomix trams and track to be fair and realistic!

There is a huge price increase when one goes from flex track and cheap rail switches to the Japanese fixed rail counterparts, for rail collectors. Adding perfect track covers to make tram track, which means zero work for the modeller, has to have some value.

And that value is: looks; reliability; and the ability to completely change the layout over time because its fixed track!!!

Actually, when Kato came out with their whole Unitram system with roadbed it was to accommodate their structures as a complete package. It makes sense in hindsight.  Their mid-rise structures would not have looked good with a 2-lane street and had they not had the street then there would be modellers crying about how hard it is to customize a road. It does somewhat abandon their Dio-town system but its to accommodate the tram track.. Time moves on..

I have near zero hobby skills and making a roadbed or track covers for curves or crossovers or switches would be difficult! And one could have done this at anytime but you don't see that many N-scale tram layouts.. Because its tough to do!

For a long time I dreamed of one day having a tram layout.. It did not require much space and trams have all the "fun" aspects of model rail such as switches, curves and crossovers. I thought about how cool it would be to have great looking double track running down a boulevard..

The Kato product looks better than one could have hoped for and if one is on a budget you can cover flex track with card stock and go "mental" trying to cover curves etc..

I do agree that greater variety in track is needed because not every street is 4-lane. If Kato releases no more than this switch, its liveable!

Finally, if you are like me and not focused on a Japanese layout, the K & T trams look great and there are some trams from the US that also look great.. A Combino tram has me excited!!

Rick

[Hobby Dreamer]

only issue about mixing and matching kato unitram with the tomix road track is the different spacing/geometries will require a lot

Way ahead of you....  and I agree 100%..

I HOPE THIS MAKES SENSE

I was thinking about a tram yard like this:

=====\============================/========
            \===========================/

using Kato track where the "/" represents a switch or curve (on the 2nd line)..


One could add Tomix track but not join it by using a structure or underpass..

=====\= XXX=========================XX/========
            \  XXX----------------------------------------------XX/
             \=XXX========================XX/

Where the X = structure and the "-" = Tomix track

The space between track pieces can be filled with vegetation or tram yard waste etc so any space or height differences can be hidden.. You don't really need the Kato track at the bottom and you can also get away without any switches

====== XXX=========================XXX========
              XXX----------------------------------------------XXX
              XXX----------------------------------------------XXX

I'd do the last thing first because I have a few non-working tram shells that would look great as scenery!

Over time, one could buy switches and incorporate more Kato product..

Hope it makes sense...

* But if I wanted to join Tomix and Kato track I would do it within the structure or overpass.. it would require a tram to rail to tram transition with maybe a bit of pushing!

Cheers
Rick

[101 Local]

I have noticed that many are criticizing Kato for not producing single track unitram plates, hasn't anyone noticed that you can in fact pull the track section out of the current unitram plates.  All Kato need do is produce single track sections in the unitram mold and you can have single track right of way.  Just as they have not yet produced left hand drive or turnouts for unitram it is only a matter of time before they do.

[linkey]

I believe KATO knows about this and will be doing a single track later in the future. At the moment they want to see how well the Unitram market sells before going for bigger steps. So just keep watching KATO's website or here when they do make them.

[Webskipper]

You know a switch to go from the double track to single track would absolutely mirror the Tucson Tram project plans.

Also a Unitram V15 street set would be a neat idea as well.

Remember folks, you can use 50-60% of a coupler spring under the high voltage wires to level out your Kato Trams. Add some prototypical articulation.

Fight the sagging mid section.

[Hobby Dreamer]

many are criticizing Kato for not producing single track unitram plates

I don't think its criticism as much as eagerness. Until recently one had to buy a whole loop from Kato so the track layouts were limited; everybody with a clone layout. And it could also be expensive both for the track and structures etc... if you expanded.

"linkey" is perfectly correct.. Kato will deliver because they invested considerably in the trams and track system so far.

But if they only release the switch, its more than one could have hoped for. There is a lot that can be done except maybe a few "filler" sizes of track - for non-traditional configuration geometries.

But it would be amazing to have single track, or just 2-lane street plates for side streets for less urban layouts. And smaller radii would be cool too..

Right now, there is no real good way for having an East-bound tram loop onto the same double track but to go West-bound. Having single loops and straights would allow that. And having a single track switch opens up the layout to other interesting combinations..

From about 2 years ago to today both Kato and Tomix have released a ton of tram-related products, so its hard to complain but having an unique layout would also be cool!!

Rick

[Mudkip Orange]

These would be priced fairly... at 110 JPY to 1 USD!

[rpierce000]

The biggest thing they have done at the moment is eliminated the two hardest things in MR, coupling and electrical reversals. You cannot build a reversing loop in UniTram track (without adding UniTrack) and trams do not couple together. This allows them penetration into a market that does not know about or WANT to know about these things. All they want to do is be able to put it all together in a short period of time, make it run in a semi prototypical fashion and then it is easy to put away again. This allows for younger users, users with less space (very important in Japan), and users not interested in the trains as much as the buildings and details.

They will add to the system, but they will be very careful not to alienate this expanded user base, so things like switches may have automatic reverse loop systems in them, or at least a plug in location, despite the cost. UniTram will stay simple, they have spent too much on making it their flagship for that market.

[bill937ca]

Most Modemo trams have couplers.  Never heard of the Keifuku Electric Railway? Two-car tram trains still operate. Enoden is legally considered a tramway and has two car trains. The Tosa Electric Railway had train operation until the late 1980s and the Gifu 600v lines were a beehive of tram train operation until March 2005. 

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/eoVN7WKKp54" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/eoVN7WKKp54</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/plwr44TLgMc" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/plwr44TLgMc</a>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL4B262393B7A2632C&NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=L2vhGVSODI8

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/0s5U14lgYa4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/0s5U14lgYa4</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/WfD2ZewYWiY" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/WfD2ZewYWiY</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/W9DIdSccP3A" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/W9DIdSccP3A</a>

[KenS]

Well yes, but you don't have to couple them up for them to look "real".  One tram on a street looks just as natural as a two-car set, which isn't something you can say about an EMU/DMU or freight.

I think the point makes sense: Kato wants to have a "entry level" train for older modelers, and Unitram fits that bill.  It has all the "build a city" aspects of kids play sets, but for "kids" who are teens or older (perhaps serving as a bridge from B-Trains or Pla-Rail), and it's a gateway to the full range of Unitrack and holds appeal for adult modelers as well. And if it's not as rich as Tomix's offerrings, well that hasn't seemed to bother them with ordinary Unitrack.

Kato's never been known to rush when it comes to introducing new models (although the original intro of Unitram seemed like a bit of a rush for them, likely to get some share of market from Tomix).  I wouldn't be surprised if it takes a long time for single-track Unitram street track to show up as there's plenty for them to do to enhance the sets without it (switches, for one).  I also wouldn't be surprised if it turned up tomorrow. I gave up trying to predict Kato some time ago.

[cteno4]

Kato took a few years working on the unitram by accounts of folks at the release. trams in japan are big time for modelers, lots of ttrak streetcar going on. they definitely took the higher end road than tomix so i think it was an effort to compete without directly competing. they had announced they had a longer term plan with the untram stuff but i dont think they elaborated any specifics other than look for other stuff to come.

kato has liked the modular, prebuilt approach with diotown and such so i can see unitram as pretty direct reflection of their history. they have not been super flexible in the past though to fill in the odd bits that might be easy to stay focused on their planned path. tomytec seems to be more willing to go with the flow.

jeff

[Hobby Dreamer]

I'm optimistic about Kato... Until I joined here I never thought them small or closed minded, limited etc.. They sell a ton of trains and although not as much track as Tomix and Peco etc its hard not to find a LHS in North America without Kato products..

IST mentioned that the Kato representative discussed Combino trams, that I don't think are used in Japan. So they seem to want to market their tram system outside Japan.

So far, the Kato displays at rail shows have been either a fully detailed loop with structures or a mishmash of tram and train track that looks pretty crappy. That seems to fly in Japan but not here or in Europe. No one wants a layout as IST posted from Kato's booth. If the Kato rep discussed products I'm certain that someone attending mentioned how good it would be not to have makeshift layouts or that at least something less than 4-lane roads would be good.

Maybe a single track switch would be asking too much but they will have options such as track without road plate..

Kato has released a ton of new product recently so I trust my eyes and not the position that Kato is limited in their product philosophy etc.. They have brand new and the best trams, the best tram track system, a new array of structures that fit this system, new trams since initial release, new track as well and are displaying their stuff in Europe. And they mention new stuff coming..

Sounds optimistic!!!

[disturbman]

IST mentioned that the Kato representative discussed Combino trams, that I don't think are used in Japan. So they seem to want to market their tram system outside Japan.

Doch, some Combinos are used on the Hiroden and a version of these trams was released by Modemo. :) That's a "one stone two bird thing", they could offer different liveries to cater for different geographic zones.

[Hobby Dreamer]

Thanks Disturbman..

It seemed great that Kato would do something non-Japanese but its always smart for manufacturers to get the "2 birds"!!

Toronto is to use new trams in 2 years that look a lot like the Combinos so that might be fun if the livery is almost correct. The Bombardiers they plan to buy look ugly compared to others in the Flexity line..

[rpierce000]

Just to reply to the coupler comment, none of Kato's trams, to my knowledge, have couplers. That does not mean they exclude couplers, it just means you have to leave the Kato nest to get into them.

[IST]

Just to reply to the coupler comment, none of Kato's trams, to my knowledge, have couplers.

What about the German type Kato Düwag trams?

[rpierce000]

I sit corrected.

I was referring to the UniTram series marketed in Japan with that set for those users we have been discussing.

[Hobby Dreamer]

In the 2012 Kato catalog this switch does not seem to appear?

It "almost" looks there but there is a single track turnout that starts its turn too early to not be something other than another type of intersection. (3-way)

When translated, none of the descriptions sound like a turnout and the name "Yunitoramu" is used, probably because the road plate is wider.

Bill posted this image, which is similar enough to the proposed Kato turnout, but the image in the catalog is different having a 3rd track.



This image is similar to the proposed Kato switch but there is a single piece of track near the bottom of the catalog photo that seems to start (or end, depending how you view this) near the turn - but its too close to the the turn going north on the southern track.

I wonder if the "Yunitoramu" series is intended to represent prototypical track or something?

Anyone know?
Rick

[KenS]

It looks to me like the photo Westfalen posted of the catalog shows two switches, a Wye and a left hand turnout, with a 15-degree crossing used in conjunction with the Wye.  The text you translated doesn't seem to quite match that photo. It could be that 40-211 ("R branches double track crossing") is not just a mirror image of 40-210 ("Multi-line branch intersection"). Or Kato could be showing a not-yet-listed prototype Wye in addition to one of the two switches.  I think we'll have to wait to see what shows up.  And then they'll surprise us six months later with something we never saw coming.

However "Yunitoramu" is just a phonetic version of the Japanese ユニトラム, which Kato uses all over their website for the existing Unitram parts. It's not a new term; it's what Google translate provides for that text on their existing pages (most of the text there is on images and untranslatable, but you can find text versions there spelled the same way).

[Hobby Dreamer]

Thanks Ken!

And then they'll surprise us six months later with something we never saw coming.

I'm so impressed with Kato's throughput of new product.. At a time where a lot of stores/businesses are closing or selling less or even when Japanese model shops stop exporting its nice to see something positive and brand new!

Even if I were not into trams it would be fun too look at the catalog or internet sites just to see their new items..

Cheers..
Rick

[westfalen]

If this is

is what Kato is going to make surely they could have found a prototype photo that matched because junctions like that are everywhere. I got this one while randomly taking photos of trams in Hiroshima one evening. I think we should "watch this space" because Kato are up to something. Modular switch and crossing components to make up the junction design of your choice?

[Webskipper]

Anymore info or dates on these switches?

I'm almost done soldering drops to each of my tram tracks for the automation and will be installing them this week.

It's going to be fun dismantling the team tracks later in the year to slip in switches but so what, it'll add more dimension.

I wired it all up the right way. Commons are the inner rails and controlled blocks are the outside rails. This way there is not much fuss for switches.

[westfalen]

We've only just gotten the new level crossing and I think it was the last of the 'coming this year' items in the 2011 catalog, so my best guess is we should see the Unitram switch sometime between now and January 2012.

[Webskipper]

2013?

[keitaro]

i doubt 2013

mainly the reasoning being that the crossing wasn't a critical product that didn't have an alternative. therefore it was not necessary for them to rush to replace it.

a switch on the otherhand has not current alternative except for some homebrew job with peco or some one else's rail.

i wouldn't be surprised if you saw this around september.

[westfalen]

2013?

That's what I meant, but as Keitaro say hopefully sooner than later. The turntable might be the thing in this year's new items that takes the longest to develop.

[rpierce000]

    Part No   Description   
    40-210   Intersection  double track fork L   
    40-211   Intersection  double track fork R   
    40-031   Unitram 62mm Straight Track Plate    
    40-101   Unitram Curve Straight Track Plate, intersection left   
    40-102   Unitram Curve Straight Track Plate, intersection right   
    40-300   Unitram 90° intersection 62mm Track Plate   
    41-100   Unitram Road plate - inside intersection   

OK, this is what the catalog, translated by my wholesaler, says is coming in 2012. I have to assume those first two items are SWITCHES!!! He does say that "intersection" means that it will either be a T or + intersection with the switch on it. Intersection L and R are Ts, I do not know what an inside intersection is. With all of these as separate parts the ability to build a much more flexible and intricate UniTram layout will be extremely extended.

I will get them into the US as fast as I can, I do not have release dates yet.

Bob

[KenS]

Already covered at some length in this thread.  Do you have any new info on specific details or schedule?

[brill27mcb]

Already covered at some length in this thread.  Do you have any new info on specific details or schedule?

Am I not understanding something? The thread you reference is this very one, and Bob's presentation of the specific part numbers with descriptions is "new info" I think.

Rich K.

[to2leo]

That's exciting news!  I hope the product will be out by October when I am in Japan!

Now if Kato is going to release long articulated low floor tram, I will finally be able to complete my layout!

[KenS]

Already covered at some length in this thread.  Do you have any new info on specific details or schedule?

Am I not understanding something? The thread you reference is this very one, and Bob's presentation of the specific part numbers with descriptions is "new info" I think.

It wasn't in this thread when I wrote it.     One of the moderators must have moved it.

I'd thought the catalog numbers had been posted before, but you're right those are new.

[westfalen]

I posted a scan of the catalog when it came out but we didn't have a transaltion then. We unfortunately still don't know much more as railway terminology never seems to translate well.

[Hobby Dreamer]

Hi Westfalen!

You posted here on page 8:
http://www.jnsforum.com/index.php/topic,10.350.html

There was a translation of the tram stuff in the 2012 Kato catalog that seems to accord with the recent one from this thread. It also seems to be what we saw in the catalog photo. Kato did not show it clearly but it looks to be a "+" intersection as the track goes straight and has turnouts.

From the Japanese:
Multi-line branch intersection L 40-210
40-211 R branches double track crossing
Straight line trajectory Yunitoramu 40-031 62mm plate
40-101 Yunitoramu left curved trajectory crossing the plate
40-102 curved track crossing the plate right Yunitoramu
62mm orbit crossing the plate 90 ° 40-300 Yunitoramu
Highway 41-100 intersection Yunitoramu inner plate

The 40-300 seems to suggest a 90 degree crossover (from both this and the other text)

Hope this helps..
Rick

[101 Local]

Kato USA Direct Newsletter - Announcement of new UNITRAM track set availability

http://www.katousa.com/N/Unitrack/UNITRAM.html announced today:

UNITRAM Street Track System
Kato USA is now taking orders for a new line of N Gauge UNITRAM track sets, and has a new website in place with all of the details of this new system!

The first deliveries from Japan of these new sets are expected at the end of April 2012.

UNITRAM is currently only available in a variety of packaged sets with Left-handed (Japanese style) street printing, and your local hobby store may need to special order them for you. All information you need can be found below, and you can contact your local hobby store to confirm availability.

And best of all!!!!!!
To download the English language instruction manual for the V50 and UNITRAM track system, CLICK HERE. 
That's right, a link to instructions in english!!

[rpierce000]

Please note the trams are NOT listed yet. Interesting.... Velly interesting....  Plus nothing about the new stuff.

And, as you pointed out they left it all left hand drive. It will be interesting to see how that goes over.

Bob