Tomix C61.20 Steam loco

[angusmclean]

Just test-run this newly released model after eagerly awaiting its arrival. I had purchased an earlier Tomix steamer released some years ago, A 9600 class 2-8-0 which turned out to be a dud, as it couldn't haul even three coaches up a moderate incline due to slippage. On opening the box of the C61, the intricacies of the fine pipework were instantly obvious - enough to make a Kato and Microace model designer to weep!  There are many extra detailings to add, and it will be tiring job as they are so small and spindly. I haven't seen fittings this small before and appear to be absolutely in scale. Lighting is at both ends and the loco runs quietly and smoothly.  Next test, coaches for a six-car passenger train, and oops. Couldn't pull them up the first slight incline (way below the standard incline formular promoted by the Japanese manufacturers) because of slippage. GRRRRR   I skipped buying the Tomix C57 because of the price, and demurred a bit paying 30-40% more than a Kato or Micrace steam loco just because of the fine appearance and self-reassurance that THEY would have sorted out the traction issue by now. NOPE. Four of the driving wheels have traction tyres and the pickup is from the tender wheels, but the whole model is very light, and this seems to be the cause of the problem - not enough weight on the driving wheels for hill traction. Very, very disappointing. It is not because of lack of comparison with other models, as I have a large number of Kato and Microace steam locos on the shelf. In summary - a perfect looking model, runs very smoothly on level track, just don't use it on an incline and expect performance.

 

Angus

[westfalen]

I was teetering on the brink of buying one after seeing the real thing in person last year but your review and the prospect of installing DCC has me leaning towards the 'pass on this one' direction, unless I find out DCC installation is easier than most Tomix locos.

[grumbeast]

This seems to be an issue with all high quality (in terms of looks) steam from a bunch of countries (not just Japanese locos).  I've deliberately taken out inclines on my layouts as I really want to run some steam.  I've been reluctant to get any Japanese outline steam just for that reason.  I have the famed Kato USRA Mikado and I have to say I'm not impressed, looks lovely, cant pull the skin off a rice pudding.  The only steam I have that seems to work are those with tender drive (basically a small B-B loco) but of course the tender has to be big enough.

[Martijn Meerts]

It's a problem with steamers that have he motor hidden in the boiler. MicroAce has so far decided to have the motor visible in the cab, which doesn't look very good, but that way they can fill the entire boiler with weight, making the trains run much better. I have plenty European steamers from Minitrix, Fleischmann and Arnold, and all those with a plastic shell and hidden motor just don't run very well. The exception is the ones that have the motor in the tender, but that has it's own set of disadvantages.

 

I haven't really tested my Tomix C61 yet, and I can't really test it on an incline until I convert it to DCC, considering the only analog 'layout' I have is a simple oval.

 

 

 

 

I was teetering on the brink of buying one after seeing the real thing in person last year but your review and the prospect of installing DCC has me leaning towards the 'pass on this one' direction, unless I find out DCC installation is easier than most Tomix locos.

 

I installed a decoder in the Tomix C57, which wasn't straight forward, but not the most difficult install I've done. I posted about it here: http://www.jnsforum.com/community/topic/3457-tomix-c57-135-decoder-install/ .. Fairly certain the C61 is very similar.

[westfalen]

http://www5a.biglobe.ne.jp/~toyoyasu/c61tm_3.htm

I found a photo of the C61 with the body shell off, I'm starting to lean the other way now.

Edited July 15, 2013 by westfalen

[miyakoji]

Sorry to hear that Angus, but thanks for the information.  Isn't there any place where you could put some lead?

[angusmclean]

Doubt it.  The site provided by Westfalen gives a good appreciation of the limited space in the boiler barrel

 

http://www5a.biglobe...asu/c61tm_3.htm

 

Angus

[westfalen]

Maybe the existing weight in the boiler could be replaced with something heavier. I recently picked up a couple of packs of this tungsten putty from Woodland Scenics.

 

http://pinecar.woodlandscenics.com/show/Item/P3922/page/1

[miyakoji]

almost twice the density of lead and non-toxic, wow

[westfalen]

Well, I caved in and ordered a C61. It will be mainly running on the level T-TRAK modules anyway, or I can double head it with D51 498.

 

Any idea what the insides of the tender are like? I'm wondering if I can fit an MRC sound decoder inside.

[cteno4]

Well they got that wrong. density is only about 40% more with tungsten. Lead 11.34 g/cm3 and tungsten at 15.62 g/cm3.

 

What you need to be close to 2x the density would be depleted uranium at 19.1 g/cm3

 

Jeff

Edited July 16, 2013 by cteno4

[miyakoji]

probably not non-toxic eh?

[cteno4]

I blew it I grabbed the tungsten carbide densit. Pure tungsten density is 19.25 g/cm3, better than depleted uranium!

 

But I think these putts are actually much lower densities. To get close to the above density you would need to use packed powdered tungsten. Tungsten putty probably around or a little less than the density of lead depending on its composition. Still easier to get into odd spaces!

 

Jeff

Edited July 16, 2013 by cteno4

[cteno4]

probably not non-toxic eh?

 

Well you can either get stupid (lead) or maybe glow... Jeff

[Fenway Park]

The Tomix 9600 has the motor in the tender driving the loco wheels via a shaft from the tender to the loco. Made for Tomix in the Bachmann factory in China and possibly with Bachmann input. Sadly not a great success and a poor runner. 

 

I have not been able to test my C61 yet so am concerned at the poor haulage sounds similar to the Tomix C57. 

 

The Kato USA mikado was their first attempt to mount the motor in the boiler and its problems led to the considerable delay in their version of the 9600. 

 

Malcolm

[angusmclean]

Malcolm and others, be very careful when handling the 9600, as if the tender/loco are flexed, the drive shaft can easily drop out, and if on carpet, can take hours to locate :(

 

Angus

[Fenway Park]

Thanks for the warning.

 

Malcolm

[westfalen]

My C61 arrived a couple of days ago and I've just finished the DCC installation. I fitted a TCS Z2 decoder crosswise in the oil bunker, drilled and tapped a couple of brass screws into each side of the tender weight for pickup and ran the grey and orange wires to the back of the motor. For simplicity I've taken out the tender light and left the head light as is so it's on all the time, you can turn it off by turning the chimney like some of the later Kato steamers. Since I took the photo I've painted the exposed wires black and am off to A1 Sushi for a Japanese lunch while the paint dries.

Edited July 27, 2013 by westfalen