Bandai B-Train Shorty

[kvp]

Would be interesting to see how they would do an EH500 or EH 800.

Someone here has been thinking about the same:

http://www.jnsforum.com/community/topic/10620-contacting-bandai/

 

ps: some newer trains might have licensing issues but Bandai is trying to keep up with JRE sets

[kami_illy]

Someone here has been thinking about the same:

http://www.jnsforum.com/community/topic/10620-contacting-bandai/

 

I saw this one too. But it didn't really convince me. This would mean that the EHs are just two locos coupled together. The image in my mind was more like they did on the Enoden cars. This way you can still motorize it and it would be more like the real thing (following the concept of b-trains), ...maybe.

[kvp]

The EH-s are really just two locos coupled with some shared subsystems. The enoden cars are articulated in real life, while the EH-s are not. The posted suggestion is the correct way in btrain style.

[hans-diesel]

about: ED79, 618076-2347200-1500, the new one with rolling trucks

 

A few days ago I received 2 of these new ED79 models. I have not put them together already. But my conclusion right now is that these are NOT models of the ED79 but from the ED75-700. Why? As you might know the ED79 is a converted ED75-700. The biggest visual difference is the big gray cover on the roof of the ED79 that the ED75-700 does not have. And the Bandai model does not have the gray cover! The stickers in the boxes also include numbers for the ED75-700. So calling it a ED75-700 is fine. I think that Bandai on purpose did not put the gray cover on the roof, because then they could not sell it anymore as ED75-700 (why did they not put class ED75 also on the box?). And Bandai could say that with creating a shorty, compromises must be made. But for me it is a ED75-700 and NOT a ED79! Do I have a problem with it? No, the ED75-700 is my favorite locomotive while the ED79 is much lower on that list.

 

And in the boxes are 3 pantographs, 2 sciccors types and 1 one-arm type. From this point the ED75-700, an early ED79 or a late ED79 can be created.

 

Now knowing this, I checked an older Bandai shorty of the ED79 (number 618076-2216340-2400, from a Hokutosei set). The same, I miss the gray cover.

 

Just an observation, do with it what you want, greetings, Hans

I made a mistake: I didn't know that the prototype subclass ED79-100 had NO gray cover on the roof.

So these 2 Bandai sets can be a prototypical correct ED79-100.

 

Unfortunately the ED79-100 didn't tow a train on its own. It was a "booster" locomotive. They drove always in combination with an ED79-0. And we still have no ED79-0 B-Train Shorty.

 

Hans

[kvp]

Actually the gray box was besides the the black box. So we could assume that was left off as selective compression. The ed79-20 this btrain was made after actually has a few pictures with the gray box missing and some equipment showing in place of the box. Otherwise the box mentions both the 0 and the 100 subclasses and the ed75-700-s. (the 100 class needs one front type from both as they were half conversions) I assume the idea was to allow all 3 variants with minimal parts. You could add the gray box, but the question is where? There is no room on the short roof...

[kami_illy]

The EH-s are really just two locos coupled with some shared subsystems. The enoden cars are articulated in real life, while the EH-s are not. The posted suggestion is the correct way in btrain style.

 

True. Technically they are like two coupled locos and also true that this would be the correct translation into b-train. But somehow for me it doesn't look right... This way it appears that the EH's are twice as long as 'normal' locos.

 

I found this kit bashed one from this site

This is what i had in mind. This guy also made a M250 and a lot of other great trains.

 

In the end i think it is about how you put you priorities (prototypical or conceptual or just "this looks cool" ;)

Edited September 12, 2016 by kami_illy

[kvp]

Considering he made a single cab but 4 axle DF50, that's more like fantasy than getting the original one squeezed into the b-train size. Not to mention most (maybe all?) of his shorties are not motorised.

[chinbeard]

I just got my Odakyu 7000 and was surprised to see they have basic underfloor detail that clips into the chassis, is this new ? None of my other shorties have this feature.

[kvp]

All of them with the newer frames have the slot for underfloor parts and there were some eariler 3rd party metal kits that actually used it. Normally, the bogies are so close together, that you won't see much from it, so most people didn't really need them, but it's a nice thing Bandai started including them in some kits. (the big question is, if they can be installed with the working bogies or not)

[bill937ca]

A couple of Bandai B-Train videos with Railway Idol Yukino Saito.

 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2016 by bill937ca

[bill937ca]

What is different about a Bandai Special Selection?  3,780 Yen for three cars!

 

http://bandai-hobby.net/train/bss/deha3450.html#a10

[kvp]

Actually you could build 3 different sets, or rather the same set in 3 different epochs and it's an exclusive or high grade set, with support (guide) for a specially themed diorama, that is built around this set. (the various diorama parts are from different 3rd party sources, but the main component is also from Bandai) Many modellers will buy 3 boxes and build all 3 different states to have a complete collection from this type. Bandai also has lots of non exclusive sets from the same train company and route.

 

ps: this is similar to the various Tomytec exclusive and event sets or more or less to the Tomix HG exclusive sets

[kami_illy]

I am looking for the blue roof of an EF66 that i could trade for the gray roof with the air condition boxes. 

Also selling some of my b-trains here. 

 

And, i was asking this before, does anybody know a manufacturer or a place where you can get bogie covers for b-train locos ( in this case ED79, EF510, EF210 and EF66)? I converted some of them with the motor unit 3 / 5. So far i put some left over covers from Emus that somehow don't look too off. But i am not really happy with that. Original covers would give them the perfect look. 

 

Thanks in advance.

Edited November 21, 2016 by kami_illy

[hans-diesel]

I expect that the bogie covers of the new 4 axle locomotives will fit the Unit 3 / 5 (if it fits a F bogie, why not). But then you have to buy new locos just for the bogies. Bandai have now released an ED79 (ED75), EF65-500 and EF81 with these bogie covers. The EF81 has roughly the same bogies as the EF64-1000 and the Seibu E851 locomotieves.

 

I am still expecting Bandai to come up with a motor unit to fit these new locomotive frames with bogies (smaller than the motor units 3 and 5). But I have not heard anything about that.

 

Hans

 

 

edit: I was wrong, the bogie covers for the F-bogie do NOT fit the other bogies

Edited December 4, 2016 by hans-diesel

[hans-diesel]

hi kami_illy,

 

which power unit (3 or 5) do you prefer for powering the locomotives? I am planning to do the same.

 

Hans

[kami_illy]

hi kami_illy,

 

which power unit (3 or 5) do you prefer for powering the locomotives? I am planning to do the same.

 

Hans

hi hans, 

 

so far i did two conversions and used the unit 5 for both (probably bc they are meant for the diesel locos). Actually the unit 5 is almost identical with the unit 3. As far as i know the only difference is the little hooks on the side of the unit 3 which hook into the body of the cars. in the unit 5 these are missing. My thought was that i couldn't use these hooks so i would cut them off anyways. A while ago i posted some photos of the process (in this thread i think). 

 

Recently i saw photos of someone cutting little holes in the chassis of a loco and using the hooks of the unit 3 to connect them. For the next loco i will try this and see if it works better. So far i am doing everything by trial and error. 

Edited November 22, 2016 by kami_illy

[hans-diesel]

I like the way Bandai now promotes the new stuff. Much more information on the dedicated pages with nice pictures. For instance on the 20 series passenger cars that will come this month. Also information about how to create a prototypical correct train.

[bill937ca]

I like the way Bandai now promotes the new stuff. Much more information on the dedicated pages with nice pictures. For instance on the 20 series passenger cars that will come this month. Also information about how to create a prototypical correct train.

 

You mean this page?.   http://bandai-hobby.net/train/bss/20kei.html#a00

[hans-diesel]

Yes, indeed. I should have put the link in myself, thanks.

[nickhp]

While it is nice that Bandai is now allowing for pivoting bogie sideframes on their locos, the fact that they are using the F trucks with shorter wheelbase compared to standard trucks is disappointing.  Essentially the locos will be dummies and the motor chassis goes in the passenger cars.  That's fine for passenger trains, but not for freight train applications.

 

For now I will continue to modify my older locos by notching out the chassis for use with chassis 3 with side clips and use dd51 sideframes.

[hans-diesel]

Oh oh, I never used the F-trucks before, I didn't know they had a different wheelbase. This week I received a box out Japan with the new ED75, EF65-500, EF81 and F-trucks. I am going to inspect it into detail.

[hans-diesel]

While it is nice that Bandai is now allowing for pivoting bogie sideframes on their locos, the fact that they are using the F trucks with shorter wheelbase compared to standard trucks is disappointing.  Essentially the locos will be dummies and the motor chassis goes in the passenger cars.  That's fine for passenger trains, but not for freight train applications.

 

I was planning to use a WaKi 8000 (passenger baggage car that looks like a freight car) with motor unit for powering a freight train. But i just read from a Google translation that the WaKi 8000 is not compatible with a motor unit. So I need to check this also.

[nickhp]

Oh oh, I never used the F-trucks before, I didn't know they had a different wheelbase.

Sorry, I thought you knew the difference!

 

Look at the spacing between the wheels of this F truck:

 

 

Versus the spacing of the regular truck:

 

 

Not too big a difference, but definitely different enough that it won't look/work right. Also notice the different sideframe attachment approach (single "pin" on f truck, double on regular truck). Since the regular trucks are longer, will there be a clearance issue with the front "skirt" too? Looks like the coupler tab on the F trucks protrudes further than on the regular trucks to compensate for the shorter truck length, so maybe not an issue?

Edited December 4, 2016 by nickhp

[hans-diesel]

very clear, thanks

[kami_illy]

 Since the regular trucks are longer, will there be a clearance issue with the front "skirt" too? 

 

There might be. On the ED79 and the EF510 there is no problem since their skirts don't go around much on the sides. With the EF66, which i am working on now, it looks like the skirt doesn't have enough clearance for the wheels / side covers. I am not far into the investigation though and i saw a lot of photos on the web of people using the 3 or 5 units to convert these. So it might work. 

 

Anyways i agree with you. Hooray for more prototypical wheels on locos! But F-trucks and no motor..? Too bad.