China launches world's fastest train service

[bikkuri bahn]

On the Wuhan-Guangzhou route. Average speed for non-stop trains is 313km/h.  As typical for Chinese media sources, not noted is the fact that the CRH2 trainsets being used for this service are derived from the JR East/KHI E2 design.

 

Video, and article w/pictures:

 

http://english.cctv.com/program/chinatoday/20091227/100766_1.shtml

(note the segment with the Chinese govt official, you can see the typical Japanese design of the retractable hat/coat hook on the wall between windows)

 

wikipedia entry on this route- note no mention of Kawasaki Heavy Industries, though European makers are mentioned:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wuguang_Passenger_Railway

[Mudkip Orange]

Yo I definitely saw kawasaki mentioned on the Wiki article.

[Kabutoni]

Yo I definitely saw kawasaki mentioned on the Wiki article.

"The trains are based on technology developed by Siemens and Kawasaki, modified to the standards of China Railway High-speed. The trains used on the line are manufactured completely in China." as of 08-01-2010, 20:24 CMT

[westfalen]

If only Australia and the US could take the existing Shinkansen and ICE technology and actually use it instead of spending decades and millions of dollars on studies and then doing nothing anyway.

[Mudkip Orange]

If only Australia and the US could take the existing Shinkansen and ICE technology and actually use it instead of spending decades and millions of dollars on studies and then doing nothing anyway.

 

The "studies" are there to get the political credit for "doing something," without taking the political negative that comes from actually doing something - like "your train is going to cut right through my mother-in-law's estate!" or "the new high-speed line will negatively impact the only remaining habitat of the wild grey always-shits-on-your-car bird!"

 

But at least a couple places (i.e. California) are starting to get serious. Texas got pretty damn close before the airline interests killed it.

[qwertyaardvark]

Texas got pretty damn close before the airline interests killed it.

 

And that is why, to this day and till the day i die, i refuse to fly Southwest Airlines.  :angryfire:

[to2leo]

US will build high-speed trains when all the automakers and airlines are taken over by foreign companies....IMHO   So don't hold your breath!

[qwertyaardvark]

US will build high-speed trains when all the automakers and airlines are taken over by foreign companies....IMHO  So don't hold your breath!

 

I beg to differ. The Texas High Speed Rail Corporation, California High Speed Rail Authority, et al have my full support and cooperation. :icon_salut: So help me (insert supernatural being(s) here), I will live in an America that has HSR, or die trying!

[westfalen]

If only Australia and the US could take the existing Shinkansen and ICE technology and actually use it instead of spending decades and millions of dollars on studies and then doing nothing anyway.

 

The "studies" are there to get the political credit for "doing something," without taking the political negative that comes from actually doing something - like "your train is going to cut right through my mother-in-law's estate!" or "the new high-speed line will negatively impact the only remaining habitat of the wild grey always-shits-on-your-car bird!"

 

But at least a couple places (i.e. California) are starting to get serious. Texas got pretty damn close before the airline interests killed it.

There are plenty of those birds around here.

[Mudkip Orange]

US will build high-speed trains when all the automakers and airlines are taken over by foreign companies....IMHO

 

I don't really think that's true.

 

Firstly because *true* high-speed lines (200km/h on existing lines or 250km/h on new lines, as defined by the UIC) don't really compete with cars, they compete with airlines. Secondly because the foreign automakers aren't really any more "progressive" then the domestics.

 

If anything else the sheer idiocy that is the TSA has so thoroughly soured everyone on flying that public support for high-speed rail is orders of magnitude greater than it was 10 years ago - the political establishment just hasn't caught up yet. This includes the FRA (which ludicrously insists that 90mph is "high speed") as well as, sadly, Amtrak, which remains committed to a policy of incrementalism despite the facially obvious incompatibility between high-speed trains and long American freight extras (as opposed to the integrated 'fast freight' / passenger services like you see in Japan and Switzerland).

 

Florida actually passed a high-speed rail proposal, it was so successful that Jeb Bush had to step in and kill it. And California is "betting the farm" on high-speed, they've actually *excluded* all of the more incremental improvements (such as improving Caltrain/Metrolink/San Joaquins) in their funding request, on the basis that the true federal funding push should be for high speed on dedicated tracks.

 

Give it a couple more election cycles (and a couple years of TSA agents looking through your wife and 8-year-old daughter's clothing) and I think it'll move a lot faster then most people thought was possible. True high-speed rail has never really been a challenge from an engineering standpoint.

[to2leo]

Maybe I should expand my statement.

 

US automakers and its gang of real estates and oil/energy companies are the ones influencing the government from urban planning policies to job cut threats to getting rid of public transportation and passenger train service as seen through out US history.

 

Auto industry is one of the greatest wealth generators and one of the founders of US consumerism and 'the American Dream'.

 

As a result, I am not surprised to see there is not a single true high speed rail line in US until something major happens like the US auto industry is being taken over by foreign interest.

 

US airlines industry is another story...

[bikkuri bahn]

Yo I definitely saw kawasaki mentioned on the Wiki article.

 

There was no mention when I read the article on Dec. 28.  Apparently somebody was astute enough to modify the entry, which is what wikipedia is all about 

[Mudkip Orange]

There was no mention when I read the article on Dec. 28.  Apparently somebody was astute enough to modify the entry, which is what wikipedia is all about 

 

I did see a number of news articles which mentioned Alstom but neglected Kawasaki.

 

But without exception, they were all sourced from an AP Wire story that was itself regurgitated from an AFP story. You can sorta understand why the AFP would want to hype the Continent's contribution to the system.

[serenityFan]

More pictures, this time from The Age, keep an eye out for a wide shot of wuhan rail station (picture #10)... 

 

http://www.theage.com.au/photogallery/travel/china-unveils-worlds-fastest-train/20091229-lidp.html

[bikkuri bahn]

Yes, that's a nice station.  Though 11 platforms for a forecasted (2020) 162 trains a day seems to be overkill.  I guess they have the money.

[disturbman]

Or, god forbid, they want to show off. 

[angusmclean]

It seems strange that there are several quotes regarding the 'average speed' of 350kph in some sites I have seen, when the maximum line speed is only 350kph.  Must be an instant magic carpet ride.

 

Angus

[bikkuri bahn]

It seems strange that there are several quotes regarding the 'average speed' of 350kph in some sites I have seen, when the maximum line speed is only 350kph.  Must be an instant magic carpet ride.

 

I think those 350kph numbers are more PR hype than reality.  In the runup to the Beijing Olympics, there were similar claims on other HSR lines, but after that event was over, the actual operating speeds dropped, which is in line with normal "best practices" for HSR- sustained 350kph operation causes undue wear and tear to the catenary and pantographs.

[westfalen]

There was an short item in a local paper here yesterday about the Chinese looking into building a high speed line linking China with Europe in return for rights to natural resources in the countries it passes through. They were projecting a two day journey time from Paris to Beijing.

[CaptOblivious]

It seems strange that there are several quotes regarding the 'average speed' of 350kph in some sites I have seen, when the maximum line speed is only 350kph.  Must be an instant magic carpet ride.

 

Angus

 

Nevermind the acceleration forces on departure and arrival!

[disturbman]

There was an short item in a local paper here yesterday about the Chinese looking into building a high speed line linking China with Europe in return for rights to natural resources in the countries it passes through. They were projecting a two day journey time from Paris to Beijing.

 

Never mind the cost of the journey and the energy you'll waste on having an Europe/China HSR.

[clem24]

There was an short item in a local paper here yesterday about the Chinese looking into building a high speed line linking China with Europe in return for rights to natural resources in the countries it passes through. They were projecting a two day journey time from Paris to Beijing.

 

Never mind the cost of the journey and the energy you'll waste on having an Europe/China HSR.

 

Or how many people in China can afford to go to Europe.. Or how many Europeans actually have an interest in visiting China. 

[bikkuri bahn]

Or how many people in China can afford to go to Europe.

 

Oh, the moneyed classes in China will surely be able to afford it (I see them everyday snatching up boxes of cold medicine here in Sapporo), but not the tens of (hundreds?) millions of the peasant and/or ethnic minority classes, like the ones that will live below the viaducts that will carry these trains.

[westfalen]

I read on another forum that China is now taking the credit for the high speed rail technology that it bought from Japan and Germany as its own. Could this end up another industry lost to China?

[bikkuri bahn]

I read on another forum that China is now taking the credit for the high speed rail technology that it bought from Japan and Germany as its own. Could this end up another industry lost to China?

 

The possibility exists.  And nobody (except JR Central) will call out the Chinese on this (for obvious reasons).  The basic tenet of business in the Middle Kingdom is- "do anything to benefit yourself, and screw anyone else if you can get away with it".  Of course, many businesses in the West would do the same thing if not for regulations, a respect for copyrights, and the checks and balances that exist in a free society.